The Mindful FIRE Podcast

204 : The W.I.L.D Approach to Financial Independence with Amber Howarth

• Adam Coelho • Season 1 • Episode 204

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In this episode: financial independence, veterinary conservation, money mindset, intentional spending, personal purpose with Amber Howarth

Episode Summary
Join Amber Howarth on the Mindful Fire Podcast as she shares her inspiring journey from being a veterinarian to a financial coach, intertwining her passions for wildlife conservation and financial independence. Amber discusses her experiences navigating student debt, the impact of the pandemic, and her evolving career path, while emphasizing the importance of mindset and intentional living.

Guest Bio
Amber Howarth is a traditionally trained veterinarian turned financial coach. With a passion for wildlife conservation, she combines her veterinary expertise with financial independence coaching to help others craft lives they love. Currently based in Korea, Amber is actively involved in conservation efforts and coaching others on achieving financial well-being.

Resources & Books Mentioned

Guest Contact Information

Key Takeaways

  • The importance of managing student debt without sacrificing life enjoyment.
  • Embrace little p purpose by integrating joy into daily life.
  • Mindset plays a crucial role in financial success and personal fulfillment.

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Speaker:

Welcome to the Mindful Fire Podcast, a show about crafting a life you love and making work optional using the tools of mindfulness, envisioning, and financial independence. I'm your host, Adam Quail, and I'm so glad you're. Each episode of the Mindful Fire Podcast explores these three tools through teachings, guided meditations, and inspiring interviews with people actually living them to craft a life they love. If you're ready to start your Mindful Fire journey, go to mindful fire.org/start and download my free envisioning guide in just 10 minutes. This guide will help you craft a clear and inspiring vision for your life. Again, you can download it for free@mindfulfire.org slash start. Let's jump into today's. Episode.

Adam Coelho:

Amber, welcome to the Mindful Fire Podcast. I'm so glad to have you here.

Amber Howarth:

Thank you so much. I'm excited to be here today.

Adam Coelho:

I'm excited to dive into this. I know we connected a few months ago and I was really interested in sharing your story on the podcast and have you, share your journey with the audience. So let's start there. I'd love to have you start by sharing who you are, your journey, and what you're up to in the world.

Amber Howarth:

I am Amber Haworth. I am traditionally trained as a veterinarian, And now I'm starting to go through different chapters. So to take everybody back for a second, I was one of those people who wanted to be a veterinarian since I think I was four years old. I came into it, my grandma always volunteered at the hospital and had a little box underneath her sink in the bathroom with first aid stuff. And I would take it and I'd run around the house and everyone would get doctored, the humans, the dogs, everybody would get, a towel wrapped around their arm or something, a bandage somewhere But that's how this started. My parents also had a cat before I was born. We got a Rottweiler when I was two and we kind of kept collecting animals as US kids grew up. And my grandparents always joked with us that we were the House Zoo. So we always, had animals in the house and were doing things like that. so I just continued that path and that love. my dad and I also would watch the Crocodile Hunter on TV with Steve Irwin and I really got into wildlife in that way and I just kept pursuing through high school, through my undergrad. I was nose to the grindstone. very nerdy. Still kind of am till today in a way or in several ways if you ask my husband. But, I just started doing everything that I could to get into vet school. And I did. And the messaging that I received from family members was, you go to school, you get a degree, you come out the other side, you go to work and you work until you retire. And that was kind of your pathway. And that was what was expected of me. So I went and I did that and I got myself almost into negative$200,000 of school loans. And luckily for me, that was only graduate school. I had scholarships and other things for undergrad, but that was how expensive graduate school was gonna be for me. And so my husband and I had gotten married. Throughout vet school, and it was always at the back of my mind going through school, how am I gonna pay for this?$200,000 is a house basically. You could own a house with that in some parts of the country. other parts, maybe not today, but back then, yes, and I felt guilty. I felt truly, really guilty going into a new marriage with all of this debt, knowing that my husband didn't have any debt and that I was gonna be bringing him down with that. So I graduated in 2020 when the whole world decided to shut down and take a pause, and there were some good things that came out of it. my husband and I at that time were living across the country because our trainings had pulled us in different directions. He is a military and he's an Apache pilot, so he was going to school for all of that. he had recently graduated and moved to his first duty station and the hospital, the teaching hospital that I was at once, the news of COVID roamed around, said that we can't continue for you guys to be in the hospital. Everyone has to go home, but we can't graduate you yet. So I took that as I'm gonna fly, be stuck with him. If I'm gonna be stuck with anybody, I'd rather be with him than in my apartment by myself. So I flew down there to be with him and since I couldn't, I wasn't graduated, I couldn't work. we had some online stuff to do, but it definitely going from an 18 hour workload day of what they expected in the teaching hospital to absolutely nothing, I was going a little stir crazy. So I started researching and I fell into Phi, white Coat investor, afford anything, all of those, and I just could not get enough of that. My mind and my wheels started turning because I knew there were other ways to live. My aunt and uncle growing up have their own business and they're very, very successful. And I knew that people did their finances differently and there was another way to do things other than work until you retire and sometimes even. people work past that and they're still working in their eighties just because they can't afford to retire. And I just could not get enough of it. So I went into my first year of being graduated as a new veterinarian and my husband deployed that year. We ended up paying off my student loans in about 14 months. So we did have the pause, we had 0% interest, which really helped during that time. But I knew that I wanted to pay the debt off because it was such a huge weight on my shoulders. and we just attacked it. I mean, we were putting multiple thousands of dollars towards the debt and we almost. Pursued it a little bit too hard, to the point where later on my husband told me, he goes, yeah, I didn't really like you at that point in our lives. You were going a little too hard at the debt here. And that was a big wake up call of, oh, we need to take the foot off the gas pebble a little bit. You can't deprive yourself so much that you're not enjoying life anymore. But we paid it off and we started investing and we started slowly relearning how do we have this life that we love, but we also are saving for the future? And so with that, when he got back, we moved across the country again to the south, and I started relieving in that area. I picked up some work from another company, consulting as a coach to other veterinarians and. Did that for a little bit until we got the news of, Hey, you're moving again, but this time it's not across the country, it's going to be across the ocean to the other side of the world. And that was quite a shock. so we had to pick up and move the military, through this process was really good and helped move all of our things and everything. But then again, I had to transition into a new space and a new work life balance. We ended up moving to Korea and we've been here since July of 2023. And with that, I've had to position work a little bit differently and figure out what I wanna do going forward and how all of that's gonna fit into the military life that my husband leads and me as his spouse. But that ended up. shaping me into more of a traveler and being willing to solo travel by myself and hopping onto some conservation events and volunteering in South Africa, going to Thailand, working with elephants and bringing about all of that. The idea for my, I'm a financial coach as well, and I'm in the process of getting my A-F-C-P-E credentialing for financial coaching, but I started thinking probably in 2022, maybe 2023, the very beginning, that it'd be really nice to own my own business and work for myself. And that idea got planted into my head while I was in vet school. I had a mentor that I met through one of the clubs that I joined that always said, you. Can do financially better for yourself and for your family and all of that if you own a business and you fast track yourself a little bit more. And that idea sat with me, and then I worked for his company for a little bit there. And I knew from hopping clinics across the country with my husband as the military moved us that I did wanna own. And originally that was gonna be a vet clinic. And then the idea kept shaping and forming until I was like, well, if we are gonna move internationally potentially multiple times throughout this career, I should start financial coaching because it's something that I am hugely interested in. I've done thousands of hours in research on it, and I love helping friends and family with their finances and making sure that the numbers make sense for them. And now that they can have a life that they truly love now and. Later on towards retirement. So as I think I said a little bit earlier, there's just seasons and chapters that we've continuously gone through, and as the military has shifted us and moved us from one place to the other, our ideas keep changing and what I need to do and be adaptable keeps changing. So that's where I eventually decided to go on the financial coaching route, as well as getting more involved in conservation.

Adam Coelho:

Very cool. Well, that's quite a journey. I appreciate you sharing that, and I think there are a few things that stand out to me, versus just how cool it is to be living your childhood dream of wanting to be a veterinarian. And, I don't know what exactly your dream was, but for me it sounds much cooler to be like taking care of elephants than, just taking care of sick dogs. yeah, I mean, either way it's great, but pretty cool. I mean, you sent me some pictures to show my kids of you taking care of elephants in Thailand and looks pretty awesome. I gotta say.

Amber Howarth:

they are so amazing. Hollywood, I feel like, does elephants a disservice because they are so quiet, so they will sneak up on you. Mm-hmm. I feel like Hollywood makes elephants, the ground shakes as soon as they move. And yes, it does. If they're running and there's multiple running, but when it's just one or two walking, they're so quiet. And the other thing is you, you're like in Jurassic Park, the noises that an elephant can make, there's so many different tones and different growls and. All these different things that you don't even realize until you go. And I tell all the students that I take, into Elephant Nature Park in Thailand, it just, you're literally in Jurassic Park. It is so amazing. And anyone who has the chance to go, to Thailand and experience that definitely should. It's life changing.

Adam Coelho:

That's amazing. Yeah. That's so cool. And then the other thing that stands out is just the resilience, Like so many changes, so many restarts, so many unforeseen things, I mean, that's life. But you, you've had a lot of that in a very short period of time. and so I guess just like how, how do you think about that? how do you bounce back when you have to go to Korea, which presumably you've never been to know, don't know anybody there. And you started over like any lessons in terms of resilience?

Amber Howarth:

Definitely. It was hard, I'm not gonna lie. It was really hard. And when we first found out, I was a little scared and skeptical and nervous. It did help a little bit. My husband deployed here in June of 2020 to 2021, but they kept him pretty locked down on the base. So he did not get to explore Korea very much, but he had at least a little bit of an inkling of what to expect. And yeah, it was a culture shock coming here just to see the differences and to learn their customs and rules and all of that. But we kept an open mind and we kept pushing through. For me what helps is having little. Things to look forward to. So, shortly after we moved here was my trip planned to Africa to go and, help with, we did Rhino de Hornings, rhino captures and moving, we darted buffalo and ended up relocating them to a different game reserve. And so just having little things along the way to look forward to. And then I will say to the community here, is tight knit just because on post Humphreys is really big and we're the biggest installation overseas. But with that being said, we're kind of like a little island of Americans floating in a sea of Koreans. So going to different events, Putting myself out there on the Facebook groups that Camp Humphreys has and everything really helped with that. And then just keeping an open mind going with the flow, as I said earlier, really helped with the resilience.

Adam Coelho:

Yeah, That's awesome. And, and yeah, it sounds like you're doing quite a bit of, solo traveling and, and I guess I'm curious like how, when you think about this next chapter of your life, like with the financial coaching and then the veterinarian conservation work, like how does that all come together? Right? And like yeah, how do you balance it all and, and kind of what does that vision look like?

Amber Howarth:

Yeah, so conservation and finances are actually more married than people think, and we all are on the same planet. We all have to live, we all have to use the planet's natural resources. So in a way, we all affect one another. Even the Tiniest species like your bees and your spiders and things like that. We all play a role and that comes into contact with finances because finances also make the world go round and helps with everything. Without finances, you can't have one or the other. not unless we go back to bartering as we were in the caveman days, but for balancing it. with my business being solely online, I'm able to take it with me wherever I go. And I do share that with my community of where I'm at and the different places that I'm traveling to. for example, I just recently went to Bali and went to the FI retreat there, with Amy,

Adam Coelho:

The five Freedom Retreat with Amy Minkley, who was a guest on the podcast on episode 1 26.

Amber Howarth:

Oh, that's so awesome. yeah, she was absolutely amazing. I tried to get into the first Bali retreat and it sold out in eight minutes. I was right there. I had, the room picked out and ready to go, ready to hit submit, and then the website was just, Nope, no more spots we're done, we're sold out. So I'm so happy that she ended up putting together a second retreat for all of us. But I was expecting to walk into that and solely talk about numbers and. Go deep with people into that, and it completely flipped the script on me. I walked in and it was all about your purpose and your emotions and what to do next, which was absolutely amazing. And I learned so much from the other attendees, the speakers, I highly recommend to anyone who's interested to definitely go, this was my very first, fi retreat, get together, anything. I had never done anything like this before and so I'm so excited to keep exploring FinCon and Economy Campfire. I'm sure there's a bunch of other ones that I'm not listing here, but just wow. And I, I loved how it married finances with the travel and tying both of them together.

Adam Coelho:

Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah, Amy goes to all the events. She loves pie events so much that she created her own, There's such a power to be in community with people who have similar interests and are kind of living differently than most people, I am now early retired. I say semi-retired because I'm, building this business, but my vision was always to do it in my own time and my own way. But, most people are working right? So like, I've been doing a lot of golfing, so I'll be golfing and I'm always like. how are you out here? Right. And a lot of the people are older and are traditionally retired, but, I was playing with this other guy, he's, he's a Bar Mitzvah dj. He does events and they're all on the weekend usually, so he can play during the week. So I was like, all right, lemme get your number and let's hang out, let's do more of this. but it is cool to be at these fire events. And I've only been to one, I've only been to, economy where I met Amy in person, but yes, it's so important to have these communities. And so I guess, like you said, there was a lot of work around purpose there. and curious, like what were some of the takeaways there?

Amber Howarth:

It is definitely one of the things that I am still working on. But, Jordan Grommet was there, doc G ah, some people know him and they actually did a live podcast, with him and Jackie, Cummings.

Adam Coelho:

Oh, yeah.

Amber Howarth:

there as well. Yeah, it was so much fun to watch'em work together, but in essence, it was all about finding your little p purpose and not your big p purpose. so basically just adding things into your daily life that bring you joy and taking out the things that don't, and a lot of us wait for purpose to kind of smack you in the face. And I feel like that has happened to me a little bit of you're reaching this goal, trying to become a veterinarian, and as soon as you graduate, you had this moment where it was like, now what? I just did it. I've worked, all my life essentially. And then eight years of undergrad and graduate school. But now, now what do I do is that, what's the next goal? How do I keep leveling up, essentially? Mm-hmm. And a lot of us chase that goal after goal and this and this. And I'll be happy if I get to X number or I'll be happy if I just had this, or whatever it is. And that made a lasting impression on me personally, because it truly is, you can't wait for purpose just to smack you in the face. You have to go out and, and do something. And it doesn't necessarily have to be world shattering. you hear world hunger and put that into place. But it's just the little things that you can put into your day. Every single day, or week or month, that truly bring you joy and take out the things that don't and make it what you want. You have to curate your own purpose. You can't let others in the external validation bring it in for you.

Adam Coelho:

Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. I forgot that he was gonna be there. Yeah. So another guest on the podcast, episode one 60 where we talk about big P versus little p purpose and Yeah, absolutely. you need to build your purpose, as you go, as you get more clarity by taking little steps. And, yeah, I love that concept of little p purpose and, just really. Useful. And so pretty cool that you're able to be there and do that with him and Jackie and everybody. yeah, met both of them at economy as well. that's how he became a guest on the podcast. so community again.

Amber Howarth:

small world in the PHI community.

Adam Coelho:

It is, it is. And, everyone is so supportive, like, that's the thing I love about this. It's like, even if we offer similar services, like, you offer financial coaching And I offer envisioning coaching, some, what I offer is very similar to some of the guests that I've had, but I don't see us in competition at all. I see that we're all supporting the community, we're all supporting each other, and we're still a minuscule portion of the population, right? That live this way, that understand these concepts, that realize the potential for building financial independence and creating a life that you love, as I always say on this podcast. So it's, it's really cool to, to be in places where you can build together and create new ideas and new ways of doing things. So That's awesome. So I guess I'm curious, like what, as I, I don't mean to put you on the spot here, but like, what is your little p purpose that you're building? how are you building that? Yeah. What have you learned so far, I guess?

Amber Howarth:

Yeah. so far on this crazy journey that life has brought us into my little p purpose right now is being able to wake up, go for a run with the dogs or go to the gym. I have two dogs that are our fur children right now. We don't have any children of our own currently, but our dogs are our absolute children. we love taking them for runs or for walks in the morning, going to the gym, and then being able to work on my business and being able to. Promote financial independence, what it stands for, and then also dive into more of the money mindset behind that. And like we've mentioned before, pairing that with conservation because they just go hand in hand. And we affect our ecosystem and the ecosystem affects us and we can't live without one or the other. And so being able to work on that, I do still, we call it relief in the veterinary world. It basically just means that I'm a independent contractor for a clinic or a company or something like that. I've gotten into touch. I don't know if anyone in the community here would know, but, jungle doctors on Instagram. She's a vet based out of Australia and she travels worldwide to help out with conservation projects. So I've gotten into touch with her to try to add more conservation onto my plate because I do really enjoy helping wildlife and giving back and volunteering. And so right now that is what I am building out as my little p purpose, as well as being able to travel with my husband and just see the world.

Adam Coelho:

Very cool. And so a lot of this work that you do, this veterinary work, is it paid work or is it volunteer work?

Amber Howarth:

The conservation portion has been mainly unpaid right now. as I gain more experience in that.'cause I did not do like an internship or anything like that right after veterinary school in wildlife or zoology or anything like that. so as I build up that, maybe one day it'll be paid, but right now it is unpaid. The other portion of that is I do work a little bit on base as a veterinarian, seeing dogs and cats. There's enough Americans over here in Korea that they need extra help with the veterinary care on base, because we have that many animals to see. And then I will go back to the states and work mainly in Arizona. That's where my family's from. So I'm able to go back with them, stay with them for a little bit, say hi to the family and the friends and all of that. Then the Thailand program that I work with is called Loop Abroad, and they bring pre veterinary students, veterinary students, and then also, occasionally high schoolers, mainly over from the United States. But there have been, some students from Europe as well as Puerto Rico, Australia coming over and joining us, and we take'em through a two week program that they can actually get college credit for if they're in college. We do a week with the shelter medicine. There's a Thai veterinarian there who's doing the hands-on surgeries of the spay and neuter. And then us American veterinarians are in charge of the anesthesia and teaching the kids all about anesthesia, going through the workbook, doing daily lessons with'em. They do have a final exam for that as well. And then we take a week to go up to the Elephant Nature Park, where we partner with the Thai vets, the Thai elephant vets there, and I call them kids, and I know that some of them are not kids, but still to me, they're my kids for the two weeks that I have'em. they get hands-on experience with the elephants. They get to, potentially clean wounds and, and give the elephants injections and other things, whatever, that elephant vet for that day has to do. And that's safe for the students to do and partake in.

Adam Coelho:

Got it. So Amber, let's switch gears a little bit and talk about your financial coaching practice. And I know you have this concept that you call wild, and you told me when we first talked what it means, but I have forgotten and I'm very interested for you to share your approach to financial coaching and what wild stands for.

Amber Howarth:

Awesome. I would love to get into that. I would love to say too, I love earlier how you stated there are, A bunch of people in financial coaching and, and doing different things like this, but everyone comes from a different background and I never feel like I'm in competition with anyone else because we all have the different backgrounds, the different experiences, and almost putting different touch points on the financial journey process. The wild method, it came out of my love for finances and conservation. Again, merging them together. But the first part, the W stands for wealth management and Wealth Mindset. And so truly digging into your money mindset and what that means for you because. Growing up, everyone's parents came from a different background and their parents taught them different things about money, which then translated to the kids. and I've even heard from some of my clients that I've talked to, even between siblings, they learned different things from their parents. Even though the parents were telling them the same thing, they took away different pieces of that message and internalized it differently even though it was the same household, same situation, same stressors. And so I really wanted to focus on that. And that came about. I was in a business group coaching program, and we would help each other out, depending on what our coaching profile was in this group. And one of the ladies, was like, oh, I, I really need to work on my money mindset and. That sparked something me. I was like, Tons of people have things from their childhood or from their past relationships or things that they've done in the past that come from that money mindset where they just need a reframe or a little bit of a rewiring or a nudge through that. So that's why the first portion of this wild method is all about the mindset behind money. The I is for intentional spending and investing. my husband and I tried doing a budget and we definitely were very budget heavy when we came out of veterinary school and we're trying to pay off. That mountain of debt. And we soon realized for us that a budget was just very restrict and we didn't like that word. And I feel like a lot of people don't in this space. It has a lot of sometimes bad connotations to it. And I didn't want, to go around saying budget and have people kind of do that immediate like, oh you, well what do you do for a living? You, oh, you help people budget. And so intentional spending is just easier to handle. People like to spend money. Most people, there are some people in this space that it's really, really hard for them to spend money, but it just helps relax that a little bit. And if you do truly make sure that your money is going into the categories that you want it to, you're gonna feel better about it and your money is gonna work for you. The. Investing portion comes an educational piece around, what are the different buckets? What is a 401k, if that's where they're at and need that help. but that's how month two is set up essentially with the I. and again, since I am a financial coach, I legally cannot provide, different portfolios and anything like that for anyone. And I do make that really clear to the people that I work with, that it is all an educational piece. but I really do love helping people understand the system a little bit better because a lot of people come into it and they think it's this complicated, complex thing, and you have to be sitting online, from 8:00 AM in the morning until the afternoon, figuring things out every single day with the stock market. The L is your lifestyle design, and I absolutely love this. It's taking everything that you worked on in the mindset portion and your intentional spending plan that you put together and really fitting it around what you envision for yourself and. This, I really like to be flexible.'cause as I have learned, I thought that I would graduate, vet school and work in a vet clinic, until I retired and then had that golden age with this, pot of gold at the end. And I would retire and do all the things then, and life changes faster than that. And you need to be able to have a plan and be more adaptable in that. So really honing in on the values and where you're wanting to go and where you, what do you want right now, and how that's gonna change with you as you grow. And then, the last portion, the D is for discovery. And so that fits a little bit into the lifestyle design, which is why they're paired in my program together of just discovering new things and. Hitting into that little p purpose of adding and taking away and having little experiments with life to see what you like and what you don't like.

Adam Coelho:

Very cool. I love it. I think pretty well cover it. So, tell me a little bit about how you help people evolve their mindset when it comes to finances. I think we all have our hangups about money. So I guess like how do you help people become aware of the stories that they tell themselves about money? And then how do you kind of unwind those a little bit?

Amber Howarth:

Yeah, definitely. I like to take'em through what happened during their childhood and describe all of that in detail with journaling prompts and seeing what that brings up for them and really trying to fine tune and sort all of those stories out before going forward. And so once that's done, then we talk about today and what they still feel from their childhood is having a poll on them and then going into the future of. Where do they want that to go and what do they want that to look like and what do we need to work on currently to get rid of the stories that they are currently telling themselves of writing down different affirmations. and again, going back to lots of journaling prompts thrown in there to really help them overcome those hurdles and see, what we can work with together. And then going through the different, letters even past that. It still gets brought up as we go through to continuously keep working on that mindset and making sure that we're making progress and not reverting back to where we were at.

Adam Coelho:

Yeah, that makes sense because. I always say, one of the core philosophies that I teach is that our stories create our reality, right? The way that our brain works is our brain is predictive, and it predicts based on past experience. And what we pay attention to essentially is planting, as I call it, planting seeds, which dictate what our brain predicts and ultimately what we live out. And so, when we're talking about money mindset, we have 20, 30, 40, 50 years of history practicing these old stories, and so many of them are even under the surface and unconscious. And so we first need to bring awareness to those stories. and then kind of, a question that's been helpful for me is like, is this useful? I notice myself telling me the story, oh, I'm never gonna get ahead, or, you know, I'm bad with money, or whatever it might be. Is this useful? Is this taking me where I want to go or no? And if it's not useful, it can just let it go. And so I imagine that comes up again and again throughout the process, especially as you start to make some progress, get some things in place, start to build out your investment approach and all these things, those little, unhelpful stories will rear their head and you kind of need to, address them throughout the journey.

Amber Howarth:

yeah. I definitely come across that with so many people who will keep saying, oh, I'm bad with money, or I never got taught it, so I don't know anything about it, or, whatever comes up for them. But yeah, it definitely, is really good to ask, is it useful and drop it if it isn't.

Adam Coelho:

Yeah, exactly. Is it taking or where you want to go or no, and if not mm-hmm. Choose a new story. So speaking of choosing a story, I talk about that as envisioning, but How do you help people, craft this vision for their life?

Amber Howarth:

Yeah, it's definitely a time where people can get creative and excited because usually if you ask someone, oh, if money was not an option, what would you be doing? Everyone usually has an answer for that, and it doesn't take people usually a lot of time to say something back to this, and I love to bring that up. If money wasn't an option, what would you be doing right now? And. Having them envision that and really get into the details, not just, oh, I would travel. Okay, well, write down or explain what exactly that looks like. are you on a beach? Are you in a mountain? Are you in a different country? Exactly. Detailing out, what they envision. And that's been very powerful for people.

Adam Coelho:

Yeah. And is there a certain timeframe that you have them envision? You know, I generally say like, look five years out. Right. And if everything goes better than expected, what does that look like? or do you have a timeframe that you help them look at?

Amber Howarth:

I usually do five to 10 years

Adam Coelho:

Okay. So long, long range.

Amber Howarth:

Mm-hmm. yeah. Just you to see.

Adam Coelho:

Go ahead.

Amber Howarth:

Oh, just to see the different chapters and if they would still continue. To do the same thing, or if they would jump to something else.

Adam Coelho:

interesting that you ask people, what would you be doing if money was no object, they have a quick response. I've not approached it in that way necessarily. In, everyday conversation. I generally ask people what is the big vision for your life, for me it's implied, but I should probably say it specifically, like if you had the money to do whatever you wanted. but I find that a lot of people don't have an answer for the question that I ask, which is essentially what's the big vision for your life? I find that most people never make the time to ask themselves these questions about what do you actually want and what would you be doing if you could do anything.

Amber Howarth:

Interesting. I've asked friends and clients and family, and usually I get a response back at least some sort of quick, it might be off cuff of high level. I haven't broken it down yet, but a high level, quick response.

Adam Coelho:

Yeah. I mean, obviously I love that question as like, I'm a vision guy, right? I'm all about vision and for me it doesn't need to be tethered to reality at I think different peopleapproach things in different ways. So, yeah. I guess so. Like, you got them in this long range vision, how do you back that into, okay, how do you start living this life today and building your financial situation and building your life and career to get to that vision?

Amber Howarth:

Yeah, that would go back to what can they do now to add in those little things that give them joy and breaking it down into the micro sized bites. Because I mean, if someone says, oh, I wanna quit my job and travel the world, they probably can't go and do that tomorrow. And so taking something like that and basically working backwards and breaking it down to, well, with the PTO that you have, can we start traveling? Can we make the PTO extend longer by taking advantage of all different holidays that come up throughout the us? Or maybe they transition into a job where they can do it hybrid or more so remote. That the company doesn't care necessarily where they're at as long as they're getting their work done on time. So it really depends on what that high level of vision looks like, and then finding ways for us to break it down and bring it into their life today, or maybe transition and bring it in slowly.

Adam Coelho:

Yeah, I love, hopefully

Amber Howarth:

that was a good answer, because it truly depends.

Adam Coelho:

No, of course. It definitely depends on kind of what their vision is. And, in my work when I've, led group coaching programs, my Fire starter program and just had conversations, I've had a lot of conversations with people who are considering it, and I always get them to, ask them what's their big vision, right? And if you want to do my exercise, you can download that@mindfulfire.org slash start. That exercise kind of gets that big vision out. But I think what's always interesting for me is like, the thing that's interesting is that you can start living that life right away, right? Like most of these vision, like some of them, you get so pie in the sky, it's like, well, yeah, I want to have like a private jet. It's like, well that's, yeah, maybe you're gonna take some time on that one. But most people, it's just like, I want to travel more, like you said, or I want to be able to take my kids to school every day, right? Like things like that. It's like, you can absolutely do that, right? Like if your job does not allow you to do that, you can get a different job. And so that, for me, I find that so empowering that's like, you either have what you want already or you can tweak your life slightly to start having aspects of that vision. And so when I, the promise of when I was doing my group coaching program is like. By the end of this program, you're going to be having tangible ways that you are living your vision already. And that's kind of like a, kind of a spoiler alert. It's like, because it's not that hard to do and the problem for most people is that they don't even know what they want. Right. Which is kind of the people that, when I was doing my group coaching program, it was very much for those people. They've reached financial independence. They don't know what they wanna do for their next chapter, so they just keep working and they keep doing the same thing even though they know they don't need to and they want to do something different. And so it starts with what do you actually want?

Amber Howarth:

Yeah. I definitely agree. It ties back into that little p purpose and doing mini experiments to see what you like and does it feel good? Does it fit? Do you wanna keep doing more of it and, taking out what you don't like? We did an exercise through the FI retreat with Dxi and he had us write down all of the things that we would do throughout our day, just anything and everything throughout the day, a week, a month. And then as we finished with that, we would cross out the things that we did not like. And all you have left at the end of it was the things that you did like, and that was really impactful because then you can see, okay, I like, education and I like communication and, so circling those of how do I build more of these out and let go of everything else.

Adam Coelho:

Yeah, that's a underrated approach, right? Like, we always think about adding things to our life, right? But we get a lot, there's a lot of bang for your buck and removing things that you don't like from your life. Like if you hate cleaning your house, you could find a pretty reasonably priced cleaner to do that for you, and you don't need to do that anymore, right? Mm-hmm. So that's a, that's a huge thing that I often forget about, but is, kind of a quick way to get more enjoyment out of life. And the thing I'll also say about the mini experiments, which is also an approach that I teach in my programs, it's like you don't know. You just'cause you think you want something, doesn't mean you for sure are gonna love it, right? You have to actually try it. And so you don't want to build this up. It's kinda like what you were saying about like graduating vet school. You think, oh, that's, I'm, everything's gonna be great. It's gonna be perfect. And then you get there and you're like. Okay, now what, and, and there's things about that situation that you like and that you don't like. And so mini experiments allow you to figure that out along the way with low risk, low investment, mini experiments that you can try things on. And I think that is the kind of the best way to approach all of this, because, I'll speak for myself like I'm one year into semi-retirement and I am still figuring it out. Surprise, surprise. Turns out life is just a series of figuring things out. and there are some things that, I didn't necessarily expect and I had a clear vision of what I wanted to do There's also an unwinding of the old stories, kind of back to the mindset of working in corporate America for Google, which is a fast-paced, high pressure environment for the last 14 years. There's a lot of unwinding that needs to happen to get into this new approach of being an entrepreneur in my own time, in my own way. And you know, it's a year in and I'm still learning that, So it's gonna be ongoing, so you might as well start now. That's kind of how I approach it.

Amber Howarth:

Exactly, exactly. I always thought, oh, when I get to this point, I'll finally, have it all together, have it all figured out, and life just throws you too many curve balls that you just have to keep adapting and keep going with it, and going with the flow and relearning things and learning how to do things new and differently.

Adam Coelho:

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, that's so true.

Amber Howarth:

So the even bigger vision for myself right now is to take people on a kind of, sort of like a PHI retreat, but have it also be conservation related. And do a little bit of both and how they both connect and to just truly see how wonderful and amazing the world is and how special these ecosystems are. And to be able to, talk about finances and then go on a safari at night or something like that, or even volunteering and bringing the two together. I think that would be really cool to have either a group or maybe a family or something like that be able to go and experience things.

Adam Coelho:

Okay, I love it. So you have a bigger vision. Okay, cool. So let's do that. alright Amber, so let's switch gears now into the, what I call the mindful fire Final four. Are you ready?

Amber Howarth:

Let's do it.

Adam Coelho:

Alright. So the first question is all about envisioning, right? We've talked about it already, but I'm curious, when you think five years out, what is your big vision for your life and the work that you wanna bring to the world?

Amber Howarth:

In five years time, I hope that I have a group program that will choose a different destination every year and go somewhere, new and inspiring with wildlife for people to be able to see the world that I see with the veterinary side and the conservation side, and marrying that again into a little bit of finance and mindset work and bridging the two together to be able to have an unforgettable experience and experiencing our natural world, and also working on the purpose and the mindset and everything else behind it. And I think just being able to bring those two together and being able to see both sides would be absolutely amazing.

Adam Coelho:

Very cool. That sounds awesome. So keep me posted on that. five years time my kids will be a possibly appropriate age for something like that, but that sounds really cool. And yeah, I just love that you're melding these two things together, Like I'm doing the exact same thing, right, with mindfulness and financial independence, retire early, like I always felt there was an overlap. And so it, it's cool, and you're bringing together different parts of your life and your training and your background and your passions into this one thing. it's very cool. And, I think there's a lot of, I mean, people love animals, right? People. Presumably love the world, the earth, some people, so there's, there's a lot of opportunity there, I think, and, and just, it's a different way to educate people about finances and personal finance and all of that. And for me, I think it's just so empowering when you understand your financial situation and you understand the path to financial independence, the simple path to wealth. As JL Collins says, another guest on the podcast, which was amazing, also a result of community and being at economy. like it's so empowering, Because you can take risks, you can make bets on yourself, you can build your life in a way that you want, rather than a way that is just required to pay the bills, right? And there's so many people around the world. struggling to just put food on the table, just keep a roof over their head. Richest country in the world. So many people doing that every single day, and I don't think that's, going to get better anytime soon. So I think that we each need to build these skills for ourself so that we can. carve out our own path and live the life that we want.'cause we only get this one life, so we might as well make it the best that we can.

Amber Howarth:

There's some statistic out there and I can't remember exactly. It's, I wanna say between 70 and 80% of people once they get their finances in order and know that they're gonna be okay and they don't have to work to put food on the table or keep a roof over their head, actually end up doing, philanthropic, type of events or starting their own charity or foundation or, et cetera. So it's such a big part of this community.

Adam Coelho:

Yeah. it's awesome. I had this idea when I was at Google and I kind of did a little bit of it, but I had this idea that they're called RS when people join Google and they all start on the same day and they have a big room with all of them. And I always have this idea that I want to teach these people from the very beginning, Some of them are fresh outta college, some of them, have 50 years experience, But either way, here are the financial benefits that you can take advantage of here and the core concepts that you can have in your back pocket to build wealth. Because I figure all these people are smart. They didn't get these jobs because they're not smart and they're motivated and they're ambitious and they care. Those are the type of people that should reach financial independence early. And not just have five BMWs sitting in their driveway, and then they can actually do the work that they're meant to do. Answering emails and selling ads is, some people love, wasn't my life's work, but having the ability to do financial dependence now allows me to do this. Allows me to build this podcast, allows me to figure out how I can serve people and bring people together and connect them with each other themselves and their biggest vision for life, which is my purpose. You know, it's my little p purpose and my big p purpose all in one. yeah, it's a powerful thing when you get your finances in order. You, you want to, most people want to give back, alright, let's go to question number two. The second question is, what piece of advice would you give to someone early on their path to financial independence?

Amber Howarth:

I would give someone just starting out, especially if they have debt, definitely pay it down. Try to pay it down fast if you can, but do not make the same mistake that my husband and I did of paying it down too fast. End depriving yourself of everything in life because we got to a point. Where life was not fun. And, my husband and I didn't really like each other for a time because we're paying it off too fast. And that was mainly coming from me, this pressure to get it done. So I do think getting, debt paid off is really, really good and everyone should strive to do that. And if you can do it quicker, fantastic. But don't let it become the soul thing that you talk about and the soul thing that your life revolves around for over a year or more.

Adam Coelho:

Yeah. Great advice. You need to enjoy the journey, as well as, getting rid of that debt.'cause you know, it, it's working against you. 0% interest. You know, it's impressive that you were going so hard at 0% interest, but you knew it wasn't gonna last forever. So I think that,

Amber Howarth:

yeah.

Adam Coelho:

Was was a good decision, just maybe not at the speed you were doing it. All right.

Amber Howarth:

was one of those that we didn't know, is it going to, every couple months you'd be like, oh, It's gonna stop. And you never knew what was gonna happen during that time. And so it, it was just better for us at that point, to pay it off. I know there's some other people and the community would be like, oh, you had 0% interest and you could have invested it instead. And the math probably would've worked out on their favor better than what we did. But, our mentality and our mindset was it was just hanging over our heads and we didn't like that feeling.

Adam Coelho:

Yeah, absolutely. And that's really what it's all about at the end of the day, right? Like numbers on a screen on one thing, but your lived experience and how you feel in your body and your relationship, that's a whole different thing and way more important in my opinion.

Amber Howarth:

Definitely.

Adam Coelho:

Alright, the third question is, what piece of advice would you give to someone getting started with meditation and or mindfulness?

Amber Howarth:

I love this question, and it goes back to the theme throughout all of this of don't let purpose try to smack you in the face like I did for a while. I was hoping that it would just kind of hit me one day and I'd be like, oh, this is it. This is, what it is. and instead you really truly have to build it, and you have to figure out what you like and what you don't like and keep going and keep being adaptable and pivoting and changing as you go through. and being really mindful of that, being open to having those new experiences and being open to make those connections. You truly have to go out and get things and network and connect with people. You can't just, stay constantly on the sidelines, kicking the can further down the road saying, this, it doesn't happen for me.

Adam Coelho:

Yeah. And you gotta try things, And you gotta take action and, do the mini experiments because you're not gonna figure it out by thinking about it. Right? And mm-hmm. I gotta take my own advice here, I'm pivoting my business and I've kind of been like thinking, thinking, thinking instead of just like acting, Mm-hmm. Just do it. Just try it and see what happens, but we can get in our own head, even when you know this stuff and

Speaker 2:

Thanks for joining me on today's episode of the Mindful Fire Podcast. If you enjoyed today's episode, I invite you to hit subscribe wherever you're listening to this. This just lets the platforms know you're getting value from the episodes and you want to be here when I release additional content. If you're ready to start your Mindful Fire journey, go to mindful fire.org/start and download my free envisioning guide in just 10 minutes. This guide will help you craft a clear and inspiring vision for your life. Again, you can download it for free@mindfulfire.org slash start. Thanks again and I'll catch you next time on the Mindful Fire Podcast.

Adam Coelho:

you live this stuff and you teach this stuff, you can still get in your own head. So yeah, just start living your life. And if you wanna learn more about the Big P purpose versus little p purpose, you can listen to episode one 60 with Jordan Grumet, doc G, and you can also check out his book The Purpose Code, which is a fantastic book, and kind of walks you through exactly how to identify your little p purpose and start living it. Alright Amber, and the final question is, how can people connect with you online? Learn more about what you, are doing and offering and how can people find you?

Amber Howarth:

So I am on Instagram at the fi coach and conservationist. lo and behold, my handle is very tied to what we were talking about this last hour, and I'm over on Substack at Amber Fi Coats. I also have a free guide that people can download to help cut years off your retirement timeline, as well that we will put up on the mindful fire.org/amber.

Adam Coelho:

Yeah, definitely. Go check out that guide. It's fantastic. It's again, at mindful fire.org/amber. That'll take you over to Amber's website where you can put your email in and get that guide right away. And yeah, follow her on all the platforms, all the links will be below this in the show notes. And yeah. Thank you so much, Amber, for being here and sharing your wisdom with the audience.

Amber Howarth:

Thank you so much for having me.

Speaker 3:

Thanks for joining me on today's episode of the Mindful Fire Podcast. If you enjoyed today's episode, I invite you to hit subscribe wherever you're listening to this. This just lets the platforms know you're getting value from the episodes and you want to be here when I release additional content. If you're ready to start your Mindful Fire journey, go to mindful fire.org/start and download my free envisioning guide in just 10 minutes. This guide will help you craft a clear and inspiring vision for your life. Again, you can download it for free@mindfulfire.org slash start. Thanks again and I'll catch you next time on the Mindful Fire Podcast.

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Adam Coelho

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